Call from Sabrina – 9/18

Ohhh Kevin. 🙁

Sabrina, coming hard straight out the gate… Ouch… The OSDM is piiiiissed. This is only gonna get darker.

Oh god, @kevin.

I’m going to say one simple thing here: Sabrina is wrong. That was not on you. It never was. It was always on Mason Silver.

As for why Sabrina is trying to gut punch you emotionally and get a reaction… there’s a lot of different ways to read that. Going to take some time to process.

But what happened to Joyce was not your fault.

So, is Sabrina wanting you to feel completely guilty for Joyce’s death? Just the fact that she insisted that Joyce’s blood was on your hands, and that she sounded disappointed that you were placing her death on Mason (where it rightfully belongs) is a little odd.

Welp. We have Sabrina back.

Kevin, that’s not your fault. They were going to do to Joyce whatever they wanted, regardless of whether she was encouraged to host a Q&A.

Wow.

What the hell is she doing, going around and ascribing blame for? @kevin, you’re right. You didn’t beat Joyce with a bat and throw her body in a trunk. And I can imagine there are a ton of people here who might feel the same way about giving Mason ANYTHING regarding Joyce had we known how it would have ended for her. Don’t feel guilty dude, please.

By the way, what hell is Sabrina even DOING? I mean…when’s the last time we heard from her? I feel like it’s been a seriously long time since she’s done…anything.

That’s ridiculous. Mason and Michelle didn’t need Joyce’s Facebook live stream in order to beat her with a bat. They could have done it any time, and it’s not like they couldn’t have found a way to get us to watch it. It’s not on you, Kevin.

Please.
Her blood is on your hands just as much as a fast food restaurant is at fault for running an ad that makes someone want to drive to get a burger and get hit by a car.

This passing of blame game is bullshit.
Joyce was smug. Mason was smart. Michelle was devious.
The three of them used us to play each other.

And why does Sabrina care?

@mumumusings, I think the last time we saw/heard from her was at the iConfidant meetup. Unless she called someone and I just can’t recall.

Wow, I’m disappointed in Sabrina. Why would she promote Mason’s narrative that way? Why give his twisted ideas of blame even more of a platform?

My only guess is that she wants to frighten us away from listening to any anti-OSDM voice again, ever.

It’s not going to work.

Ouch @kevin…that’s harsh. But echoing everyone else, she’s fucking wrong. You are NOT responsible for Joyce’s death.

Not sure what she’s trying to accomplish with these calls to you & @wanda102 to try & put responsibility on y’all.

I was struggling with the same thought @daela. What does she get? Other than emotional responses.

But that makes sense. “You listened to this anti-OSDM guy and now @joycecarlberg is dead. Don’t do it again.” That’s fucked up.

What exactly were you supposed to do to stop them? You were there with two crazy people with a bat that they were obviously willing to use. What does Sabrina get from trying to guilt those that were involved in any way with Mason?

How much money do we want to bet that @coryphella gets a call soon?

You guys are correct, this absolutely sounds like “You worked against the OSDM and now bad things happen. Aren’t you afraid of bad things happening?”

It’s a cheap emotional attack.
Joyce’s blood is on Mason and Michelle’s hands. No one else.

The last time we heard from Sabrina was, I believe, when she posted as THE RED ROOM GIRL threatening to leak secrets if she wasn’t allowed to speak to Remy. Then Remy spoke to her and irritatedly described it to Gordon as a “shriekfest”. Gordon warned Remy that it was best to keep her happy because she knows a lot.

She told us at the iConfidant meet and greet that she thrives on attention. We’ve seen that she’ll lie, egg us on, and play on our sympathies to get the emotional data that she wants.

Maybe our best bet is to withhold that data.

Maybe if we do, she’ll lose patience and start spilling those secrets.

CORRECTION: Russell heard from Sabrina briefly on the phone, when Joyce visited him.

• This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Lauren Bello.

Kevin, definitely not your fault at all. You didn’t even ask Joyce to do the questions, you had simply relayed that Mason wanted her to as a quote. Mason trying to “Thank you” in the video and Sabrina trying to blame you is simply incorrect.

Now on the other hand, I personally don’t think Sabrina was wrong about Cristen and her doing nothing. Yes, she did what she was told. Yes, most of us would have followed the rules and done the same thing for fear of getting reprimanded or getting hurt ourselves.

But. Sabrina is right. Nothing was done to help Joyce in that case. And yeah, if it was someone else what would have been different? What if it was Morgan? Would nothing had been done then? But it wasn’t Morgan, it was Joyce. Who still didn’t deserve to be beaten, tortured, and put to death.

Bryan DID do what he could when he was given the opportunity (also assuming he’ll be receiving a call as well) by sending someone else, although it’s questionable if that person was the best one to send (nothing against Buz, it’s a literal question of who was closest & willing to go to that location)

Add one more to the pile. Same phone number as the calls to @kevin and @wanda102.

Sabrina called, wanting to clarify that I was the last one to speak to Joyce. I told her I was. Sabrina asked what Joyce said.

I told her she said she had needed help.

Sabrina then pushed me on why me — “of all the people on the fucking planet Earth, why did she call you?”

I said it was because I was one of the few people that still had her back, when a lot of people had been eager to kick Joyce to the curb.

She started getting frustrated, and saying she “couldn’t handle” vague explanations and wanted me to think real hard. “Joyce crashed your dinner party, why?”

I told Sabrina I thought it was because Joyce had wanted to speak with @coryphella. (In case everyone doesn’t remember, Joyce pulled Megan aside that night for a private chat in my house.)

As for why Joyce called me on her final night, I told Sabrina that I thought it had to do with the fact that Mason had called me after she’d gotten the shit beaten out of her, and I’d become some sort of de facto lifeline.

Sabrina seemed taken aback by the fact that Joyce and Mason had called me on 9/1 to wish me happy birthday – almost as if she didn’t know about that part.

That’s when Sabrina hit me with it. “It seemed like you truly care. And everyone else just went ‘bye.’ But not you. You got angry.”

I told her I was still angry. “But not angry enough to save her.”

Yes, I started getting pissed then. I explain-shouted to Sabrina that when Mason had called me in fucking Toronto, I sent @thebuz on what ended up being an hour-long wild goose chase. Because YES, when it came down to it, I was willing to do everything I could to save Joyce.

She sighed. LOUDLY.

I asked why she was calling about this.

She hung up.

This is interesting because it’s like Sabrina’s basically saying “you can make choices here”. Which can potentially be opening a can of worms.

Example:

@wanda102 (happy birthday Cristen!!) was told to stay and basically observe the aftermath of Joyce’s beating. I agree with Cristen that many, if not all people here would have obeyed whoever told her to stay put and watch. This is so you don’t disrupt the observation, which makes sense. But Sabrina suggests that Cristen could have disobeyed/help Joyce if Cristen WANTED to.

This is by no means a criticism but this kinda opens up that box of not following instructions/going against the grain, from Sabrina, our former Overseer no less.

On another note I will say telling Kevin blood is on his hand–bullshit. Mason and Michelle are the ones who did the deed, not @kevin. In that same vein giving a veiled threat to Cristen is a pretty shitty move. My mother always told me that people who do this type of shit are just bouncing off their own guilt/negative emotions onto others. Something going on Sabrina to suddenly stir the pot?

If you want to be productive, Sabrina, how about going after Mason and Michelle rather than making us feel like trash? Hm?

@mkarrett funny how Sabrina guilts Kevin with blood on his hands like she doesn’t have any on hers… ?

The ” you have choices” thing intrigues me too. She is trying to trigger specific emotional responses with this, I think. Also, like I mentioned on slack, maybe she’s been brought back in to deal with the Mason situation and she’s frustrated, so lashing out at y’all like, “you could have done something but you didn’t and now it’s on me to deal with this.”

@kevin @bcbishop

Awe. You guys give a fuck, and continue to give a fuck and I don’t know why they/Sabrina should be focusing their disappointment/displeasure/sighs, at you guys. That’s an inappropriate displacement.

1) Horace, the piece of shit, couldn’t even get her name right. He couldn’t be bothered! Is anyone on the inside mad at Him? Consequences be damn? No? Crickets from the peanut gallery?

2) They need to be mad a MASON. MICHELLE.

They’re deflecting their pain and hurt, like in the angry stage of grief. They’re looking for someone to inflict upon, and who better than those who will answer their calls? Don’t take it personally, even though it may feel impossible not too.

Jesus. I hate to say it but does anyone think this is more evidence that Horace and the OSDM don’t really care about their people? That she truly was expendable to them? They’ve lost one of their own, and here now comes Sabrina seemingly just using her death to collect more emotional data on us. They know Sabrina is a WMD when it comes to busting out those emotions. I think this is 100% an OSDM ploy.

Such a difficult situation for either one of you to be in. I don’t know if any here actually blames either one of you for what happened to Joyce. I’m still processing but asking what Sabrina’s motives are. Is she hoping to bring a divide between people? Make people pause and reflect on what had happened to Joyce and place blame in places other than just Mason? Because when we’re divided the OSDM is able to see where our weaknesses are.

I don’t know.. just a thought

I mean, she may be frustrated at us because she went through hell when she was in the process of brainwashing and a small.minority of people did anything about it last year. We were extremely limited on information though! I know @thebuz and @kasch went searching for the fire pit area where she declared “~four I’m ready” and @russell did everything he could to stay by her side in the Compound round…2? Or 3? Donut mixer, some people made some effort to talk to her.

So I can get it why she may be mad at us this time around but I still stand by my former statement of you do something Sabrina, not just trash us.

Pile on. JFC.

My phone just rang and I saw the number, unblocked, and thought, Christ. I’m in trouble.

It was Sabrina. She said she was still trying to figure out what happened (she sounded like maybe she was driving a car?). She said “you talked to Mason quite a bit, didn’t you?”

“yes”

“did you talk to him…12 nights in a row?”

“except for one night when he didn’t call…yes.”

“what did you two talk about?”

I paused trying to figure out exactly what to say here and…what did we talk about? “mostly me” is what I said.

“Mostly you. And, did you enjoy these calls?”

“yes.” I think I said that pretty quietly.

She also asked somewhere in there if I was aware that he’d beaten a woman to death with a baseball bat and stuffed her body in a trunk while calling me every night. I said yes. She ended the call by saying something like (it got a bit garbled) “I hope you enjoyed your new friend and will enjoy the sounds of silence, because now you are dead to us.”

• This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Megan.

These calls are such a cheap shot, trying to throw blame when it won’t even stick. I’m not sure I see the advantage of this for Sabrina, it just manages to band us all together in support of each other.

Maybe Sabrina is trying to egg us on to be more heroic/reckless the next time? I hope we’ll all be smarter than that, than to fall into a trap so easily.

Or maybe the OSDM IE meter is reading a little low and Sabrina decided to poke us for a little more emotion?

I predict Sabrina isn’t done. I think in total 7 people will hear from her.

• This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Melissa.

I think it’s the second, @lazysmartperson. She isn’t capable of acting on her own here, too used to taking orders from the big guy. We shouldn’t be letting the iConfidants lecture us on matters of morality. I’d like to know how much the OSDM’s needle jumped when their own people heard a woman had been killed, Sabrina included. Their instruments probably aren’t sensitive enough to pick up a reading that small.

Well, from Sabrina’s stand point, it seems she found a sympathizer, an accomplice, and a neglectful bystander. She breaks you through guilt. She tries to use her charm to make you feel shitty by the choices you make because, in the end, you made a conscious decision and chose your _path. I’m still trying to figure out her motive.

I’m sorry to say that the explanation is a lot cleaner than what everyone would like it to be. This is going to be a very unpopular post, and I’m not trying to come down on anyone, but people need to take a cold hard look at their actions, or lack thereof.

All of you are complicit in Joyce’s death. I should say, all of us.

We can say you didn’t wield the bat. But we effectively walked her right into the death cage — some more than others. Remember what aStranger said to me, “Go back to your puppets, forget what is happening and your role in it“.

We wanted someone to connect with. Some of us got her. Some of us engaged with her. She was the public face of OSDM. She was the one out there, taking the risk to engage.

Because everyone wanted attention, so Joyce reached out. And in engaging her, we must consider the possibility — likelihood — that this just made her a larger target for Mason. We have no way of knowing what Mason would or would not have done. What we know is what happened, and I’m sorry, but Sabrina is right.

There’s no ulterior motive here. This isn’t about poking for emotions. It’s what happened.

@kevin DID set her up. @coryphella DID play patty cake with her killer despite knowing he was unstable and still did nothing even after there was a body in the trunk. @wanda102 DID stand there and didn’t do anything because…well, she was told not to. Happy Birthday by the way. 🙂 @Bcbishop practically served her up on a silver platter with his fawning and his T-shirts.

Worst of all, when all of this was going, did anyone send out a search party? Ask Mason directly to let her go? Do anything at all, especially after she was beaten?

Nope.

Of course Sabrina is pissed and of course she blames the individuals who were associated with the killer. Especially those who had the closest contact with her and said they “cared”. These aren’t cheap shots. Take some fucking responsibility. And enough with saying that Sabrina is taking orders or isn’t in control of herself. Seems to me that it is exactly the opposite.

And yeah, it’s on all of us.

But there’s a silver lining here. Sounds to me like this is the best thing that could’ve happened to some of you. We’re awake. We realize we’re in a cult.

You’re dead to OSDM, and that’s the way it should be. Congrats. You’re out.

• This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Lawrence Meyers.
• This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Lawrence Meyers.
• This reply was modified 7 years, 3 months ago by Lawrence Meyers.

She’s calling because they’re still looking for emotions. They saw what they could get out of us via emails with imaginary friends, and now they’re seeing what they can get in the aftermath of tragedy. And they’re still surprisingly good at it.

I’ve been feeling like Briarberg isn’t actually an outside group here – they’re not freezoners, they’re not deprogrammers, they’re obviously not researchers. I think they are influenced directly, and possibly taking orders from, the OSDM. They may not be a direct “false rebellion” ala the first gen BOS, but more of a catalyst. I strongly believe that Mason and Michelle were given an order from someone interested in emotion harvesting or whatever it’s being called. There’s no escape.

I strongly believe that Mason and Michelle were given an order from someone interested in emotion harvesting or whatever it’s being called. There’s no escape.

This. I said this over a week ago. Thank you @addisonborn.

@Bcbishop practically served her up on a silver platter with his fawning and his T-shirts.

I…are you saying that if we dare to like anyone, we are putting them in harm’s way, @larry ? I’m not sure I follow.

@daela It’s more than just liking someone. I regret to say that by elevating Joyce into a rock star, @bcbishop just made the target on her back all the larger.

That being said, liking someone is a terrible idea in this world. It makes you mighty vulnerable, as a certain phone call I received demonstrates.

I strongly believe that Mason and Michelle were given an order from someone interested in emotion harvesting or whatever it’s being called. There’s no escape.

YES. THIS. Couldn’t agree more @coryphella & @addisonborn.

#TeamRonin would like to think us all idle samurai, capable but unwilling to leap into action.

Many of us were indeed involved in the events leading up to Joyce’s death, but none of us can be held responsible. It truly is a tragedy, and knowing what we know now I’m sure that we all would have done things differently. But we weren’t prepared then, so let’s make sure we are for the next time.

Sorry @lazysmartperson but everyone is complicit. And palming it off “until next time” is not an excuse to escape responsibility.

@larry

Worst of all, when all of this was going, did anyone send out a search party?

Send out a search party? Is that what people do nowadays when there’s a kidnapping/murder? That doesn’t sound right.