This topic has 15 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 7 years, 2 months ago by 
.
-
Posts
-
-
Quote –
“Hope is like a road in the country; there never was a road, but when many people walk on it, the road comes into existence.” – Lin Yutang
Original Painting –
Indefinite Divisibility (1942) by Yves Tanguy
From the bowls collecting water to the anthropomorphic shadow cast by the form beside it, a jumble of conflicting shapes confronts the viewer, vying for our attention. Dreams and realities merge in objects such as a pedal, a propeller, and a clamp. These are three-dimensional objects about to topple to the ground. Tanguy’s intention is to express, not to communicate – to trigger sensations, not to explain. Tanguy relied upon his subconscious to supply him with ideas for paintings: “the painting develops before my eyes, unfolding its surprises as it progresses.” What is reality and what is shadow? For Freud, the heightened anxiety created by his use of depaysement (the state of disorientation experienced in dreams) was a form of psychosis, delusions and illusions. For Tanguy, it was a source of power. Surrealists celebrated madness as both an inspiration and liberation, as Breton said in dreams you could: “kill, fly faster, love to your heart’s content.” In 1950 the Psychological Institute of Vienna displayed Tanguy’s paintings beside those of schizophrenic patients to see if the public could distinguish between the two. They could not (a result that delighted the Surrealists). Breton believed that one day Tanguy’s images “will be made clear with a language which is not yet understood but which people are soon going to read, which they are going to talk, and which they are going to perceive is best adapted to the new changes.”
-
I don’t like the quote’s idea. Hope has never been something I like that people bank on to go about their life. Sure, if you need it, whatever. But I’m someone who likes to go through life with facts and judgment based on logic and reason more than hope that everything will turn out ok.
If you keep opening box #1 and it doesn’t have what you want, don’t use hope to think it’ll change. Open box #2, even if it takes more effort to get inside.
-
Dreams and realities merge in objects…Tanguy’s intention is to express, not to communicate – to trigger sensations, not to explain. Tanguy relied upon his subconscious to supply him with ideas for paintings: “the painting develops before my eyes, unfolding its surprises as it progresses.” What is reality and what is shadow? For Freud, the heightened anxiety created by his use of depaysement (the state of disorientation experienced in dreams) was a form of psychosis, delusions and illusions. For Tanguy, it was a source of power. Surrealists celebrated madness as both an inspiration and liberation, as Breton said in dreams you could: “kill, fly faster, love to your heart’s content.” In 1950 the Psychological Institute of Vienna displayed Tanguy’s paintings beside those of schizophrenic patients to see if the public could distinguish between the two. They could not.
How. PERFECT. Is. This.
Hope is a thing invented by us as a necessity in order to move forward. It’s not a judgement call on how people get where they need to go – some don’t need the road and can move forward without it, but many people find it quicker and easier to get to a place if they work together to create that road. Without that common goal, coming together and finding hope and strength together, we are all wandering lost – some of us may eventually arrive at the destination through logic, reason, use of maps, compasses, dumb luck; others may remain lost forever because there is no path and there never was.
-
Love that, @coryphella. I’d say we could even take it a step further, and frame it as a dark warning: There is no reason for hope in this world. Not with the chaos in the universe, and certainly not with the larger forces aligned against our community here. Based on facts alone, positive outcomes are unlikely (just as humanity’s very existence is so mathematically improbable).
“Hope” as we know it is a construct; an act of sheer will. When enough buy into it, however, it can materialize and have a force unto itself. But it is up to the collective — perhaps in this case, The One? — to manifest it as a group.
-
@bcbishop – That is exactly what I’m saying. Without it the world works just fine. Just as without US, the world works just fine. The question is how do WE work without hope. Some of us work just fine – do all of us? And are we here for us as individuals, or for the whole?
-
I love the description of this painting. I don’t even want to look at the painting, and just read this over and over again. Thanks for finding that, @kortneydarling!
“Hope” as we know it is a construct; an act of sheer will.
@bcbishop Yea, all of this stuff. We choose hope. We choose it despite the lack of facts and logic, knowing that hope does literally nothing except make us feel better. And that’s ok – Sometimes people need to feel better. We just have to be careful to not lose sight of the facts in the process. -
This quote actually reminds me of the famous quote by Voltaire…
“If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him”
@bcbishop, if indeed, “there is no reason for hope in this world” as you say, then I believe The One would have to create hope if it felt like there was none. There are dark things being done… alleged murder, violence, strange rituals, possible sacrifices, adultery and other forms of betrayal, corporate backstabbing…Call me a naive optimist but if there is not hope in this world then there is no reason to be here. So many have proposed theories of where this will lead, where hope could lead, perhaps.
It seems to me we are all thinking that something positive will come from this…
Justice? Saving a child? Reuniting a couple? Destroying an evil corporate entity?
Even revenge can sometimes be a positive thing… ? -
Might just be my BOS slant talking, but it feels like it might be talking about BOS. Enough people were pushing back against the OSDM / OOA that even if it didn’t TRULY exist in the first place, it came into existence. Goes off of what Michelle said at the end of last season, that we made the BOS into a real thing.
-
Heh, I had the same thought re: the path representing the formation of BOS. There never was a resistance, but when many people resist, the road comes into existence. But the question that raised for me was:
Is MyChild controlling the Facebook account? Is the slew of hopeful quotes and pleasing images its form of BOS propaganda?
-
Interesting points, @nothenrygale and @daela.
Not sure if everyone equates BOS with hope, though.
However, Michelle did state that we brought it into being.
Makes you wonder what else we can create, doesn’t it? -
-
@coryphella So basically if you want a resistance, a resistance becomes reality. If you want an actual cult, an actual cult becomes reality?
-
-
I think it’s a lot more likely this quote is in reference to ALL of us, not just one faction.
Yes, @coryphella. This is why I was angling where I was with my previous post about the big picture, state of the world thing. While BOS may be a force for justice for some, it’s far from hope in the eyes of others.
If anything, this chapter thus far has seemed to be talking about the community as a collective (something we’ve seen pop up in the past as well), and the upside of this quote seems to be about the hope and optimism that can come when large groups of people band together — beyond factions.
-
-
-
Some more talk of possible actions and their consequences, from today’s Slack chat between me and @daela…
me:
“… we’ve been told exactly how to stop what’s happening: walk away. But, no one will. So, one could argue that the BOS is working against their own stated mission by continuing to engage.”daela:
“To be fair, I think that only works if everyone does it. If BOS walked away but everyone else stayed, wouldn’t OSDM just carry on data-collecting?”me:
“Absolutely. But, maybe that’s the “hope” that was mentioned in yesterday’s quote. The path doesn’t exist until enough people walk upon it. The most difficult, self-disciplined choice any of us could make would be to walk away, to deny ourselves the adventure. Some would consider it the ultimate sacrifice. We already have the tools to help others (like Noah told us), but we’re unwilling to use them.”daela:
“Oh, interesting”daela:
“I haven’t heard that take on what the “path” is before.”
-
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
