Call from Noah – 7/27

This topic contains 77 replies, has 22 voices, and was last updated by  Violet 4 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #20615
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    Will go live in about 30 mins.

    https://www.periscope.tv/NotHenryGale

  • #20617
     Chelsea 
    Participant

    Holy shit not you too.

  • #20621
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    Before I head out, Noah basically gave me shit about all my “puffing out my chest”, calling all of my achievements “little” and of course gave me shit about the logo animation. Told me he thinks he can help me. That all this comes from a place of shame. That it’s deeply rooted in me. Told me to be at a convenience store in the next 60 minutes (so that time runs out at about 12:30) and start Periscoping. I’ll be given further instructions.

    I have even less to go off of than @chelsea did. Zero fucking clue what I’ll be asked to do.

    Noah, that toast to The Resistance better not have been for fucking nothing.

    Heading out of the office in a few minutes for an early lunch break.

  • #20634
     Chelsea 
    Participant

    @nothenrygale Dude good luck. Waiting for your return!

  • #20636
     Anonymous

    Well then…

  • #20640
     Maddyxxx 
    Participant

    Alright sideburns, I am looking for people, you ain’t it. Perhaps if you opened yourself up to what that was going to be you would have realized what you want is closer than you realize. Enjoy your refund to the big shoooow. If that upsets you, you can’t handle what’s comes next. @nothenrygale

  • #20642
     Chloe 
    Participant

    Well, I guess you did “take what’s yours”. You just did it in not doing what Noah said and did what you wanted instead.

  • #20644
     Chelsea 
    Participant

    “What you want is closer than you realize.” @nothenrygale You may have fucked up, bro.

  • #20645
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    @maddyxxx Awww, poor Noah, wanted a room full of obedient, compliant toys to play with? Sorry, I don’t roll that way.

    You said my accomplishments were little. What’s a bigger accomplishment, buying a dirty mag, or standing up to Noah Fucking Sinclair?

    Fuck you any the system you rode in on.

  • #20646
     Chloe 
    Participant

    Or you may have screwed yourself judging by what @maddyxxx has to say. Wonder what might have been waiting for you.

  • #20648
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    Lol @nothenrygale. He didn’t ask you to choose who you’d rather kill your mom or gf. You didn’t sacrifice something or make some bold move of grandeur.

    You simply refused to buy a dirty mag from 7/11.

  • #20649
     Blondie 
    Participant

    I think that standing by his principles shows @nothenrygale is exactly the kind of person the resistance needs. He doesn’t need The System or Noah’s games… Kudos bro, kudos.

  • #20650
     Maddyxxx 
    Participant

    I’ll admit, I was shocked at first but I have had some time to reflect about the fact that you believe it took a lot to do that @nothenrygaled and well, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPUfhcL7Tfo

  • #20652
     Anonymous

    One of the easiest ways to test compliance is by starting small and building up. Given his leanings towards the BoS, him nipping it in the bud seems about right.

  • #20653
     Blondie 
    Participant

    With all that’s going on, I think it’s easy to fall into the trap of believing The System wants to help people achieve their potential… Nope. The System wants your money and your data and will do whatever it takes to get those things. Noah doesn’t care about you beyond that. I am honestly humbled by how much of themselves people have been willing to give up to this so don’t take this post as me being dismissive of that. But this is all a show of power with the added perk of giving Noah the jollies at the same time…

  • #20654
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    Burn. It. Down. I’m ready for war.

    I won’t be a pawn for your little system. I will not be a toy for your amusement.

    This ends today.

    BOS

  • #20655
     Violet 
    Participant

    @nothenrygale welp, let’s hope this doesn’t come back to bite you 😉

    @maddyxxx Bring it, baby!!!

  • #20656
     Anonymous

    I am reminded of this quote, “All war is a symptom of man’s failure as a thinking animal.”

    Before throwing around words like ‘war’ perhaps step back and reflect?

  • #20657
     Sage 
    Participant

    There is a difference between compliance and being open to new experiences. I’m here to be open.

    • This reply was modified 4 months, 2 weeks ago by  Sage.
  • #20661
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    It felt good helping that woman. I saw her eating the lunchables on my way back to the car. Maybe she can trade that porno mag for something else later.

  • #20662
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    @sfire8 True. I’m absolutely open to new experiences. What I’m not open to is doing things because some slick dressed guy in a suit tells me to. Buying a dirty mag isn’t going to help me with my shame. This was not to help better myself, this was a power play. And @maddyxxx

    You know that whip that was dropped the other night? Guess who’s reaching for it.

  • #20665
     Andrew Kasch 
    Participant

    There’s a time to flip the finger to the man. This ain’t it.

    Noah wanted you to go outside your comfort zone and experience something real. You denied yourself that.
    How much would we have learned from the OOA if we were completely non-compliant to anything they asked? The Tension Experience would’ve been the “Sit-Alone-In-The-Corner Experience.”

    Don’t be so goddamn rebellious and wrapped up in your pseudo non-conformity that you miss something genuine.

  • #20666
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    Do you know what the end game was though @nothenrygale? It was to help someone else.

    There’s a less fortunate person near you right now that is without a sandwich, water, and a porno mag because you said no.

    Your actions have consequences. That’s on you.

    • #20670
       Winston Smith 
      Participant

      @thebuz So did you help someone because you wanted to, or because Noah told you to? It looks to me more like Noah helped someone, you were just the tool he used to do it. Who gets the credit for driving a nail, the hammer, or the hand that holds it?

  • #20668
     Winston Smith 
    Participant

    Way to go, @nothenrygale, total power play. It’s not important that what he asked you to do wasn’t difficult, what’s important is that the decision is yours, and yours alone.

    The lemmings don’t see what the big deal is, they’re just happy to be following their “leader”, and getting a pat on the head for being good little dancing monkeys.

    He leads, they follow, but to where?

  • #20671
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    Only the resistance could turn a good deed into nefarious happenings.

    Want to look strong and attract people to your stance? Then you have to acknowledge the good deed. Otherwise your whole thing comes off as a petty hustle.

  • #20672
     Sean 
    Moderator

    @winstonsmith – Someone was helped. Does it matter if we jerk off Noah or Buz when we lay praise on who did it? Someone did it. Good for them.

    So far we have someone being helped and someone facing a personal fear. This ain’t nearly as nefarious as some of you people seem to think that it is

    • #20678
       Winston Smith 
      Participant

      @thegilded What Noah is doing is called “grooming”. The nefarious part isn’t when he gives you attention, and tells you he likes you. It’s when he shoves his hands down yer pants, and tells you not to tell anyone about it.

      Remember that. It’s going to be important someday.

  • #20674
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    @kasch I get that. Tension truly was a life altering experience. The thing is here is that a few things went through my head while I was waiting.

    1) Dirty mags aren’t my shame. You’re gonna have to dig deeper to get to my shame Noah.
    2) Fuck The System.
    3) How does buying dirty mags help me at all? For a “self help” guru I fail to see how that has any effect.
    4) Fuck The System.
    5) What @meghanmayhem said on the Slack right before I went in struck a chord. This whole thing, involving strangers in this System BS, it just feels dirty. These people didn’t ask to be involved in this shit. They didn’t consent to it. Sure, dirty mags is “small” on the scale of things that suck to be dragged into, but I was tired of Noah’s meddling in the lives of others.
    6) Fuck The System.
    7) @kipsie is also right with what she said on the Slack. There was a long line at the counter, and my time has value. I don’t buy into his BS enough to waste my time for a magazine I’d just toss anyway.
    8) Did I mention “Fuck The System”?

    @111error You have my number. Call me when you’re able to and have a plan. Let’s do this.

  • #20676
     Chloe 
    Participant

    I’m with BOS all the way, but I don’t see Noah really doing anything wrong at the moment. He’s helping the less fortunate with food and porn and getting people out doing stuff, nothing wrong with that. 👍

    She says as Noah and fam later kill an innocent bystander

  • #20677
     Andrew Kasch 
    Participant

    I’m working hard to be pro-BOS, but the mentality of some of their members seem to be like the goth kids on South Park.

  • #20681
     Sean 
    Moderator

    Ah, my mistake. I was not aware that we were now making decisions based off what we think people are going to do. Next time some store clerk makes eye contact for too long I’ll be sure to punch them out because I think they’re going to make an aggressive move.

    Or should I avoid that too? Is your definition of “grooming” so extreme that includes all harmless trips to stores or just harmless trips to stores requested by people you think are big bad men?

    • #20692
       Winston Smith 
      Participant

      Huh? You don’t make decisions based on what you think people are going to do? You don’t wait to step off that curb, because it looks like someone might turn in front of you? Nobody is saying you should punch out anyone who looks at you funny, I’m genuinely perplexed as to how you’d construe that message.

      The contextually correct definition of grooming is:
      2. prepare or train (someone) for a particular purpose or activity.

      Do you think any of that was *at all* about helping a homeless person, or do you think it was about something else? Would that even be consistent with Noah’s actions/statements to date? He just really likes helping people, right? He’s a big softie.

  • #20686
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    Interesting part of Noah’s “interview” here:

    Interviewer: What is that you want?
    Noah: Ultimately, respect.

    Interviewer: And you’re willing to…
    Noah: Anything up to and including complete and total destruction of the status quo.

    Let’s review, shall we? Person after person get a call from Noah Sinclair. Person after person follows through with their task. Person after person continued the status quo.

    Who actually changed the status quo with @maddyxxx‘s little tasks here? Again, small change in a small game. But change has to start small before it can end big.

  • #20689
     Bryan Bishop 
    Participant

    @nothenrygale and BOS: Refusing to give things to people in need since 2017™.

  • #20691
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    @nothenrygale

    Who actually changed the status quo with @maddyxxx‘s little tasks here? Again, small change in a small game. But change has to start small before it can end big.

    Think about giving someone less fortunate than you the means to feed themselves… that’s a small change that actually means something to the greater world at large. You did nothing but flex muscles that aren’t there.

    At this point I am beginning to think you and other resistance members are trojan horses within the Resistance to rot them from the inside out. Please by all means keep doing what you’re doing. This is an absolute delight.

  • #20697
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    Follow up, since I took another look at my answer to “Why are you a failure” question on my ticket.

    “Giving in to people and organizations I find reprehensible.”

    I didn’t give in to Noah. I didn’t give in to The System.

    Hell, maybe I’m not a “failure” in life after all.

  • #20699
     Sean 
    Moderator

    Perhaps I wasn’t clear. Let me rephrase this. People here bought tickets for The System. The System promises that it’ll teach you things. Now you’re saying that the people ignoring the lessons are doing some great good thing because the leader is a big meanie head who uses bad words?

    Not every lesson is grooming. These are on par with exercise drills or exposure therapy. Casting your weak fears onto the others that are actually ballsy enough to follow through does not legitimize those fears. Exalting the coward is what got we, as a people, into a position where we need The System in the first place.

    You’re presupposing that this is a bad, horrible thing when all I see is a woman who’s faced a fear and a man that helped a homeless person. Your fears are based off a theoretical big bad and you’re ignoring the actual, nontheoretical events to justify it

    • #20703
       Winston Smith 
      Participant

      No, that’s approximately zero percent what I am saying. If someone tells me to stand in the street, choosing not to do that doesn’t mean I’m opposed to streets, or standing. It means, “Hey, someone is telling me to stand in the street. That’s a little fishy, I wonder what their motivation is? Are they trying to help me, or hurt me? Maybe I should, you know, evaluate this situation.”

      Do you think I’m trying to tell you streets are bad? No, that would be dumb.

      Do you think I’m trying to tell you that standing is bad? Nope.

      I’m trying to tell you that if you keep standing right where you are, you’re gonna get hit by a fucking truck. In that last split second, as you turn to face your fate, all will become clear, as you remember “Ohhh, that’s why I shouldn’t stand in the street.”

      In that moment, will you look back, and thank Noah for asking you to stand there, or will you feel like maybe you should have made your own choices about where you stand?

  • #20700
     Lauren Bello 
    Moderator

    Here’s the question.

    Do you really think the porno mag mission would have warped into a “feed the hungry” mission if it weren’t for Brad’s resistance?

    Chelsea’s first task didn’t have a beneficiary. I’m betting that second task wouldn’t have had one either, if Noah hadn’t needed something to rub in Brad’s face.

  • #20701
     Blondie 
    Participant

    @thebuz You are working off the assumption here that the task you completed was the task originally planned for @nothenrygale – I’m sorry but you have no idea that this is actually the case. Please tell me you don’t believe that it isn’t possible that Noah changed the game to make Brad look foolish and rash.

  • #20702
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    @blondie @daela

    Of course, that question has crossed all of our minds but regardless of how Brad’s interaction would have played out (I personally think it was going to be the same thing since they had @chelsea also do it) it was a positive venture.

    Perhaps maybe I’m just not as big a cynic to think Noah was just going to have Brad buy some mags to embarrass him.

  • #20704
     Sean 
    Moderator

    “Chelsea’s first task didn’t have a beneficiary.” is exactly what makes you wrong about the entirety of this. You’re all looking at this as though humanitarianism is the primary goal. It’s not. The goal is to better the people involved in The System. The beneficiaries are the ones performing the actions, themselves. For Chelsea, that meant being less guarded, and understanding that people are reasonable and less judgmental than she thought. For Brad, that meant that inconsequential people’s opinions on your actions don’t matter.

    When Brad failed, and he absolutely did fail, Buz was brought in to complete the task simultaneously for himself and to show the others what the risks are here – entry or banning from The System. Now Buz already doesn’t give that much of a shit as to what people think of him so Noah tacked on the end to help someone else in lieu of the fact that Buz didn’t need this lesson.

    Brad’s mission was “do things bravely” and he failed. Buz’s mission was “show the failures that they failed” and he succeeded. “Feed the homeless” was just tacked on at the end as ANOTHER good thing.

    @winstonsmith – I’d cede your ramblings as valid points if not for the fact that we literally signed up for these lessons. We literally paid US currency to be taught what Noah has to teach us. You’re hinging this all based off a danger that you have no proof of. You’re implying that following Noah’s actions are evil and bad but you A: are basing this off of what, as far as I can tell, are just the fuckin’ heeby jeebies and B: are trying to dissuade people from a class THEY WANT.

    This is the equivalent of going into a college classroom and jerking off the guy who didn’t do his homework because the professor looks shifty. You’re not a hero, you’re not a leader, you’re just being the guy that people are annoyed by when they’re trying to take notes.

  • #20705
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    To be fair @winstonsmith, this wasn’t an instruction to stand in the middle of the street. It was an instruction to buy dirty mags. Was I in danger with this task? Not at all. Was it truly meant to help me? Maybe, but I don’t see how. Was it a power play to make me a pawn to the OSDM? More likely.

    If what I did today was a “mistake” I take full responsibility for that. But if this was a means to make me submit, I don’t submit to just anyone. I submit to those I respect. And I have no respect for Noah. So am I bending the knee to his System? Not unless they can gain my respect.

  • #20706
     Blondie 
    Participant

    Can someone, ANYONE, please point me to anything, just one single thing, that shows The System wants to help people rather than just exploit them for money and data and fun?
    If good things happen, that is either done to prove a point or a happy accident… I have much more respect for someone helping out the homeless off their own back, than because Noah fucking Sinclair told them to in order to make someone else look bad… That isn’t an attack on you @thebuz, I know you’re a lovely human being and would gladly help someone in need without being told to, I’m just making a wider point that your situation helps to illustrate.
    If you don’t question the motives, then you’re walking into this blindly and that is dangerous.

  • #20708
     Andrew Kasch 
    Participant

    Can someone, ANYONE, please point me to anything, just one single thing, that shows The System wants to help people rather than just exploit them for money and data and fun?

    The answer to your inquiry lays with the man himself: Noah is, I think, a good person. Aggressive as fuck, yes. But good.

    Hell, he personally tried to save my dumb ass from falling into the iConfidant trap. He doesn’t know me from Adam.
    Thus far, he’s the only REAL person I trust in this.

    You say that you have more respect for selfless acts that are unmotivated. Change begins with self-realization and sometimes it takes other people to make you realize that. Good deeds were done today. And that’s very telling.

  • #20709
     Winston Smith 
    Participant

    @nothenrygale I agree with that. I’m not saying what he asked you to do was dangerous. I’m saying that any time someone asks you to do something, you should be thinking “Why am I being asked to do this? What is this person’s motivation? Is this in my best interests? What are the consequences of this action going to be, and am I willing to accept them?” Sometimes you have to gamble in life, but winners gamble when the odds are in their favor, not against.

    If what you did today is a “failure”, then what makes it a failure? Who did you fail? What’s the mistake? Failure to comply? Failure to confront? Failure to question? Failure to make your own choice? Failure to reach for the high shelf? Why is it presumed that Chelsea, and Buz succeeded, but you failed. You failed to comply. They failed to ask questions. Everyone, or no one failed, depending on each of our individual perspectives. What matters is what *YOU* think about what you did today, not what Noah thinks about it.

  • #20710
     Sean 
    Moderator

    @blondie – I’m viewing this as one of the first actions that The System has actually done in service of its end goal. So far I’ve seen 1: A woman facing her fear and 2: A man being told to act more valiantly. I suspect, even if it’s just a little, Chelsea feels less guarded off now. Step one on this lesson plan has shown that he’s going to make people face their inner demons. That’s a positive start.

    Now it’s your turn. What proof do you have that The System is just trying to “take the money and run”?

  • #20713
     Lauren Bello 
    Moderator

    Can we talk about Noah’s insane double standard?

    In Taylor’s “interview,” Noah said, “People respect different things but the truly powerful ultimately wind up respecting threats and challenges, not at first, but with time. It’s a process.”

    Yet when challenged by Brad, Noah’s immediate reaction was to revoke Brad’s ticket.

    Sounds like by his own standards, Noah’s not truly powerful.

  • #20714
     Sean 
    Moderator

    Have you ever been in a class in which a student didn’t do a project or homework or show up and got kicked because of it? Ever seen a trainer stop working with someone because that person wouldn’t even try? Are the trainer and professor “not truly powerful” as well?

    If you signed up for The System, but you aren’t going to do The System, you shouldn’t be in The System.

    • #20720
       Lauren Bello 
      Moderator

      Have you ever been in a class in which a student didn’t do a project or homework or show up and got kicked because of it? Ever seen a trainer stop working with someone because that person wouldn’t even try?

      I think that analogy is flawed. A better analogy might be a trainer who assigned a rigorous set of push-ups but, when asked, couldn’t do any herself.

      Noah demands from us that which he himself is incapable of giving.

      A more impressive way to respond to this challenge would be to confront Brad in the class. Can you imagine how apprehensive Brad would have been leading up to the event? The real power play would have been to put Brad through the System. Instead, publicly revoking his ticket without bringing himself to respond to the challenge made Noah look frightened.

  • #20715
     Chelsea 
    Participant

    Well, I’m still not sure that the goal was to teach me that people don’t suck and make me less guarded. I think the goal was to see if I would do something that I was clearly not OK with and didn’t want to do. Which I did. Brad also did a thing. A very bold thing. And we’ll get to see what happens because of it. All choices have consequences – good, bad, and/or interesting consequences.

    Small correction, @thegilded, Buz was not “brought in” to complete it. We were just being dicks. Which “back fired” by getting to be good people for a hot minute, which was pretty great.

    Whether or not this was the original plan doesn’t really matter to me. If there was a different plan for Brad, a choice was made on the spot to change it to benefit some strangers. I’m cool with that. If the original plan was a test of sorts and the amended plan was a good deed, does it really matter how we got there? “How dare you do nice things because the bad man told you to!” isn’t really the most rational of arguments.

    And @nothenrygale, you know where I stand on Noah being OSDM. Not buying it. 😉

  • #20716
     Kevin 
    Participant

    Brad could have made Noah try to respect him by flipping the challenge on its head, but instead he opted not to play at all. Other people have gone head first into what Noah has asked them to do and he’s been happy with the results. Trying to change the rules of engagement while not shying away from the task completely may be something that Noah actually respects though.

  • #20717
     Blondie 
    Participant

    @thegilded Exhibit 1:
    Noah’s “story” on his website
    Choice quotes include “I single handedly removed the board and replaced them with weak-minded but loyal subjects and forged new opportunities that led to record earnings that continue to this day”, “It’s not doing the “right” or “moral” thing” and “It’s about finally realizing how to craft the ancient art of not giving a fuck…”

  • #20718
     Sean 
    Moderator

    @blondie – So Noah’s a dick, and a dick who’s effective and good at business. But if you’re going to imply that “business man” and “mustache twirling villain” are the same because they’re both meanie pants, then that’s a bigger leap than saying something as outlandish as “Tension era BOS was effective at things beyond getting domed to death in sand boxes”

  • #20719
     Megan 
    Participant

    OK I’m just now catching up but I have a few thoughts.

    First of all Brad please don’t pick up that whip. That’s weird and just…weird.

    Second, calling this “grooming” is a little over the top, @winstonsmith and you’re viewing this through a very specific lens which gives you that perspective. Just like I am seeing this whole entire thing from a very DIFFERENT specific perspective, because of my own experience. I could easily call this entire thing something else.

    Since ethics in immersive theatre happens to be a current research/writing topic and something I’m really familiar with, I’ve tossed this idea around in my head all night. I also had dinner with three other artists here in Edinburgh, all of whom are immersive theatre creators. None of us thought it was unethical. You’re perfectly within your rights to disagree. But all he was told to do was to go into a store and ask for porn. He had to periscope it, but honestly he didn’t have to periscope THE CLERK, he could have periscoped HIMSELF, right? and never shown the clerk? And that might have even been the more interesting (and difficult) choice. Do you think that clerk has never had to hand over porn before? Probably to a much more unpleasant person, maybe doing unpleasant things? Who knows. No one was going to be hurt by this.

    Believe me artists in immersive art have done much, much, MUCH worse than this to the unsuspecting unconsenting public. We are truly prudes in America. I am not saying that you are wrong in wanting their consent, but there are much better hills to die on than this, and you only die on one.

    Brad didn’t want to do it and chose to not do it. Period.
    We all have choices and there are no wrong choices. He made his. He now gets to pay for it. If you think Chelsea isn’t going to pay for hers in some way I think you’re wrong.

    I don’t care about the resistance or the war or whether the System is helping anyone or whether these tasks help anyone. Figure out what it is you lust after and decide if Noah, Joyce, the Resistance, or anyone is offering you a chance at that. Stop making excuses for walking away from what you want.

  • #20721
     Blondie 
    Participant

    @thegilded So as long as everyone buying into The System self-actualises in the end, it’s all good?

  • #20722
     Sean 
    Moderator

    Got a meeting coming up so I’m gonna take a page out of Noah’s book.

    @blondie – Yup
    @daela – Nope

    Toodles folks I’m out for now

  • #20724
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    @daela

    Instead, publicly revoking his ticket without bringing himself to respond to the challenge made Noah look frightened.

    But why waste time on someone who’s already proven they aren’t interested in anything he has to say? Lost cause right there. I saw it as punishing Brad as well as opening up a ticket for someone who actually wants to go.

    And is he really incapable of giving what he asks us to give? I don’t think there’s enough evidence to suggest one way or another.

  • #20725
     Blondie 
    Participant

    Sounds like @thegilded doesn’t need The System – he’s already arrived at Noah Town. Fuck everyone that gets hurt along the way as long as the people who can give their time, money and data to The System end up happy. This is only the beginning. You think at the end of all of this, everyone is gonna be sat around, holding hands and thanking Noah for bringing them success and happiness? Hah fucking hah.
    I don’t have money to give to The System. I wasn’t “memorable” enough to Sarah Sinclair. I’m 6000 miles away. My life suuuucks, but even if I was able to jump on board that train, I wouldn’t. Because even if a few good things happen along the way, I doubt anyone is going to see all that Noah promises come to any kind of fruition.

  • #20726
     Bryan Bishop 
    Participant

    Something that seems to be missing from this conversation is the idea of what each of us, as participants (or not) in The System, get out of the bargain. That’s the question that should drive our engagement, not fear that we might get taken advantage of by a cranky skinny dude who digs cologne.

    Ostensibly, The System is meant to help people fully realize themselves. Does it do that by making everybody assholes? That’s the sales pitch, but we don’t really know yet. All we know thus far is that it entails a dude getting us to do things that require us to not give a fuck. To not give a fuck that we’re buying porn in public. To not give a fuck if people think we’re sex worker enthusiasts. To not give a fuck if rando strangers think we’re crazy because we want their cheese.

    We can view all of that as Evil Big Bad Noah putting us under his control, or we can look at what it’s actually doing: giving us practice at not giving a fuck.

    You know. Delivering on the promise of The System.

    Getting mad that @maddyxxx seems to be delivering makes zero sense to me. You can not like him — I get that 1,000 percent — but just say you don’t like him. Don’t buy a ticket to his seminar. Wait on the sidelines. It’s all good. We all have agency. But buying in with $$, only to say #HellNoBecauseResistance is hard to track as an honest choice. Granted, we’re all different – and this is solely how it reads to me — but if we want to talk optics, let’s talk optics.

    This goes back to what some of us have been saying about The OSDM the entire time, too. We show up to partake in an experiment that pushes our buttons… and then get mad and “resist” because people are making an experiment that pushes our buttons. Um, okay?

    If we want what these things have to offer us — The System, The OSDM, iConfidant — it will require us to buy in. To trust. Especially when it’s uncomfortable. That’s the only path to enlightenment.

  • #20729
     Andrew Kasch 
    Participant

    But why waste time on someone who’s already proven they aren’t interested in anything he has to say? Lost cause right there.

    Bingo.

    Imagine you’re in ROCKY…

    Mickey: “Ya gotta shot at the prize, kid!”
    Rocky: “Yo, fuck you, Mick! I ain’t no puppet!”

    *quits*

  • #20730
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    @kasch I feel like “analogies that don’t quite fit” has been the deal of the day today, on both sides.

    Noah isn’t going “Ya gotta shot at the prize”, he’s going “I don’t give a fuck about you”. He’s not a trainer, he’s not a coach, he’s a part of a machine that’s using us for data. I’m ALL down for being pushed, for having an outside motivation. And hell, Noah might very well have done just that. I don’t like Noah, I don’t get along with bullies like his “System persona”.

    My answer to “what makes you a failure in life” was 100% true. I’ve backed down and given in to organizations and people I find reprehensible. I’ve let shitty bosses push me around and make me do shitty things because I needed the paycheck. I “sold my soul” to projects I was not comfortable with because I felt like refusing would ruin my career.

    And you know what? Here we are again. A bully pushing me to do something I’m not comfortable with, and being on the verge of doing it because refusal might fuck up my experience.

    I stoop up, and I refused to let myself be used. I knew all eyes were on me. I knew pretty much everyone was watching. And I decided to not be a fucking failure anymore.

    So did The System work? You be the judge.

  • #20731
     Blondie 
    Participant

    But this is actually part of my point @bcbishop. The System focuses on personal gain, not the greater good. How is that a noble pursuit? And this is all on the assumption that Noah will follow through on his promises. Just cos you pay him, doesn’t mean he will keep to his end of the bargain in the long run.
    I’m not buying into The System so I am free to question it as much as I like. Just as you are free to hand over your money in the hope of becoming one of the selfish elite.

  • #20732
     Kevin 
    Participant

    @blondie If that personal gain is coming from realizing something about yourself or other people, is it so bad though? So far, out of the more personal things Noah has gotten people to do we’ve seen: a high five and a strange look, a friend sticking up for you, kindness from a stranger, and gratitude from a stranger. If you want to look at it even more generously, Noah has been pushing people to be open about topics that they mostly don’t want to talk about, but everyone might be better off actually discussing. Were people pushed outside of their comfort zones? Yes, but I can’t imagine everyone who signed up for The System didn’t expect a smooth ride.

  • #20733
     Bryan Bishop 
    Participant

    @blondie I think we’re actually in agreement on that. If one doesn’t buy in, or believe The System can be of use, then the only logical choice is to reject it (and any overtures Noah makes). It only makes sense to get involved if one thinks they can actually get something out of the experience, or believe it will eventually deliver in some form.

    @nothenrygale That’s a really good point, in that you did what was emotionally truthful for you. You were present. That may mean that The System is not your jam, but that just means The System may not be your jam.

    We’ve seen many paths forward in the past few months. There will no doubt be many more.

  • #20735
     Megan 
    Participant

    @bcbishop I have now written and deleted and written and deleted a post on this topic.

    Maybe I’ll try one more time.

    @maddyxxx, I wanted to address some things from the other night after some time had passed but events of today in combination with your phone call the other night got under my skin – congratulations. I’ve now been having a fight with myself over whether or not to rationalize the thoughts in my head away so that you’re no longer in there. Because I think you and I both know what it is that I want in this situation. But here’s how it goes: I hate attachment and self-centered tendencies in myself so I fight them all the time, and in this instance the self-centeredness is thinking that you had some sort of greater purpose behind hearing yourself talk when you called, something that should make me paranoid that you’re not done with me even though you told me on day one that I was a loser with a chip on my shoulder (or your wife did) and haven’t given me the time of day since, and I’m not going to your event, so I tell myself that I only ever really have one-off conversations with anyone anyway, no repeat ongoing interactions so it’s unlikely that I’ll hear from you again, I can sleep soundly…but then I think, I’m supposed to feel this way, supposed to be paranoid, even if I conjured it up because I’m a self-centered human being making assumptions that others are thinking about me when they aren’t. And this goes back and forth. It’s hard to let go and allow for that feeling when it comes with that guilt at the same time.

    I don’t let the whip go ever because when I do, nothing fucking happens. Nothing. It’s not that the world takes me on, it’s nothing. I have met very, very, very few people willing to do that so the choice is either try to control everything to get what I mostly don’t want, or be bored. I’m obviously out of reach, not going to your seminar, and you didn’t even mention “the system” to me on the phone so I think this is just you & me. I don’t care about sides or the resistance, I just want the experience that I want. Is that what you’re offering?

  • #20736
     Blondie 
    Participant

    @bcbishop We agree? Miracles do happen 😉

    The follow up I am going to make ties in with @kevin‘s response to me too.

    I see these supposedly good acts as a tactic. Give you a taste of what you could get from The System to hook everyone in. To get bums on seats if you will. But I have no doubt that these “lessons” will shift and people will be asked to do things that benefit only The System, under the ruse of self-improvement. “How can you question me now after all I’ve done for you? Don’t you trust me?”

    Believe in what you want to believe, but be prepared to be questioned on it. Just as I am for what I believe in – which is ultimately the greater good over selfish gain (dirty socialist right here)

  • #20737
     Maranda 
    Participant

    @nothenrygale Like you, I don’t want to buy what The System is selling. “Become more ‘successful’ by being inconsiderate to all those around you” — it’s not the right thing to do and will frankly do more harm than good, whether that’s just Noah’s selling point on the surface for something deeper, or whether that’s what The System really is about.

    But in its own way, I think The System has helped you by giving you an opportunity to fix what what you think is your biggest failure. In that sense, by standing up and saying no to Noah, you’ve shown that you don’t need The System to change your life for the better. Noah uninviting you just proves that.

  • #20738
     Cristen 
    Participant

    This goes back to what some of us have been saying about The OSDM the entire time, too. We show up to partake in an experiment that pushes our buttons… and then get mad and “resist” because people are making an experiment that pushes our buttons. Um, okay?

    I know I’m singing an old tune by agreeing with @bcbishop but this stood out to me in particular. I learned the very hard way that I wasn’t respecting this experience properly and suffered consequences as a result. I came through it with a new perspective, understanding, and respect for what we’ve bought into.

    And at the end of the day, I think a lot of people suffer from giving way too much of a fuck about external things. So if Noah’s got a trick to teach me how to step back into myself, drinks are on me.

  • #20739
     Maranda 
    Participant

    @wanda102 I agree with you and @bcbishop that it makes little sense to resist something when we got what we signed up for, but I believe the Resistance has a valid place in all this and want to offer my two cents. We signed up to be taken into darkness, and we are possibly almost definitely paying for that with personal information. That’s all well and good, but before the Resistance there was nothing preventing the OSDM from abusing our cooperation and information and doing some real damage. I say play the game and ‘enjoy’ the Experience, but let the Resistance be the checks and balances that prevent the OSDM from going too far.

  • #20740
     Addison 
    Participant

    Catching up on the shaninigans today.. The System seems to have many parallels to the OOA, no?

    The OOA preached being present. Throughout Ascension, we were confronted with exposure – we were asked to expose ourselves physically throughout a majority of “round 1.” The changing room, obviously. The “Chaos” room to a certain extent (I think that’s what the clock room was officially called). But we also physically exposed ourselves to the unknown – from being hooded in a speeding van, to walking into a fog filled room, to having our senses removed, to more violent situations like getting simultaneously kidnapped and carjacked, or sacrificed, or any other scenario.

    But in certain situations like the processing room and the red room, we were asked to expose ourselves emotionally. Even more so for anyone going through “Round 2.” However, in most situations, it was still possible to cover yourself.


    The System seemingly asks an even deeper form of “presence” as it seems to pick up more on the emotional exposure aspect, and as we’ve seen, has direct consequences for those that try to cover themselves. We were told straight up that the OSDM wants our emotions, that’s why iConfidant existed as it did. And now we’re randomly being asked to emotionally expose ourselves to strangers in public.

    And for the first time, we’ve been directly “warned” about something as we’re moving forward.

    Last year at this time, we were watching youtube videos of GK4 getting got by Sabrina/GK2/Addison. This year we’re already in the thick of it, there are emotionally intense situations happening for some, and as @bcbishop experienced last night, our personal safety bubbles are already being invaded.

    This is gonna get wild y’all.

  • #20741
     Jackie 
    Participant

    @nothenrygale

    And you know what? Here we are again. A bully pushing me to do something I’m not comfortable with, and being on the verge of doing it because refusal might fuck up my experience. stoop up, and I refused to let myself be used. I knew all eyes were on me. I knew pretty much everyone was watching. And I decided to not be a fucking failure anymore. So did The System work? You be the judge.

    If you feel like it was bullying, then it’s not fun anymore. I get that. I think you drew your line in the sand a little early, but when told to jump, you didn’t. It wasn’t a pass or fail test, you just answered accordingly. I don’t believe Noah was being inappropriate, we don’t even know what the original outcome would have been after the purchase. But the outcome clearly didn’t matter to you, it was the principle of the thing. It is a lonely hill to die on, but I sympathize.

    However, you martyrdom is less meaningful if others will simply walk over your corpse and take up your tasks. Opportunity and exploitation are only matters of opinion.

  • #20743
     Anonymous

    @nothenrygale You got my support, dude. Buy three smut magazines? Do those even exist anymore? Get a fucking wifi connection, Noah! I agree with Brad, this isn’t self-help, it’s more OSDM bullshit masked in a “Way To Happiness” type front. Take the data and run. Click.

  • #20751
     Shaun 
    Participant

    I’m thinking if there was no line @nothenrygale would have been game. It might not be too late to bend the knee Brad!

  • #20799
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    Welp, just got my refund for The System. Guess I’m officially out now.

    Some of you will get a kick out of the note attached with the refund:

    “Sometimes Porn is for more than jacking off.”

  • #20801
     Shaun 
    Participant

    Hah! More words to live by from Dr. Sinclair. The lessons come in such unexpected ways.

  • #20802
     Violet 
    Participant

    OH NOAH HE DIDN’T!!

    (I’m not even remotely sorry for that, just fyi)

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