Parable of The Workers in the Vineyard ("Take what is yours")

This topic contains 28 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by  Lawrence Meyers 4 months, 2 weeks ago.

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  • #20760
     Lawrence Meyers 
    Participant

    Matthew 20:14 “Take what is yours and go your way. I wish to give to this last man the same as to you.”

    Matthew Chapter 20 is a parable, an answer to Jesus’ followers who asked, “Okay, we gave up everything and are following you. What do we get?”

    The Parable

    A landowner hires workers throughout the day, from 6 AM until 5PM. He promises to pay all the workers fairly. The workers hired at 6AM were told they’d get paid one denarius. At day’s end, he first pays those who were hired last — one denarius. Those hired first expected more but got one denarius.

    They were pissed. The landowner said, “Hey, I told you what you’d be paid. Take what is yours and go away, because it’s my choice to pay this late-hired worker the same amount. Stop being jealous pricks and resentful of my generosity”.

    “Furthermore, it’s my right to do what I want with that which is justly mine. So fuck off”.

    What It Means

    The gestalt reward for following God will be the same whether you come to Him early or late.

    But here’s the good part.

    God also says everyone who follows him will get a reward, but what this reward is, and how it is distributed won’t be the same way that man distributes rewards.

    20:16 “So the last will be first, and the first last…”

    Disciples come to God at different times in their lives, so they should not be surprised if God rewards each person in different and unexpected ways. When you look at various interpretive websites, they actually say: “You get what you deserve”

    Sound familiar?

    God gives to us according to who HE is, not according to who WE are. God won’t be unfair to us, but rather, bestow greater blessings on those who are more deserving of His blessing.

    Even if he comes to the party late i.e. last shall be first. (@bcbishop)

    However, since “the ability to serve God is the gift of His grace,” @nothenrygale got booted. He was bitching over refusing to be treated in a certain manner, insisting he deserves better than this. So God gave him what he truly deserved. Exile.

    Also from the online interpretation:

    “Grace should be especially manifested in our service; it is of grace, not works.

    – All our service is already due to God; it belongs to Him.
    – The ability to serve God is the gift of His grace.
    – The call to serve God is the gift of His grace.
    – Every opportunity to serve is a gift of His grace.
    – Being in the right state of mind to do the Lord’s work is a gift of grace.
    – Success is serving God is the gift of His grace.”

    So all these tasks, which arguably lead us to self-realization (wholeness, Ouroboros, becoming one with God), is merely us serving God. The call to serve God — the inner God, our greater Self.

    And finally, the last phrase from Matthew: “For many are called, but few chosen”.

    Many of us were indeed called.

    What remains is who will be chosen.

    And for what?

    The Sinclair family is said to be direct descendants of Jesus.

    Or are we dealing with someone who is inverting God’s words — by choice or by force — to bring us into what we believe is His grace…

    But is instead….A CONVENIENCE STORE WITH PORN?

    Oh yeah. And “The Resistance”? They are the fucking Romans, and Morgan Fucking Doors…is Pontius Pilate!

  • #20764
     Lawrence Meyers 
    Participant

    OH, one more thing.

    Noah is a dead man.

    Remember the iConfidant meeting? That bit about pledging ourselves for his sacrifice? It’s Noah’s sacrifice.

    That’s why he’s drunk. That’s why he’s behaving this way. He KNOWS he’s going to be sacrificed, and hates The Father — God aka Horace — because he knows what’s coming. “Why has Thou forsaken me?”

    And remember what he said on the phone — one of you is not who they say they are. That would be Judas.

    Few are chosen. I’m betting 12 of us will be on August 13.

    Who is Judas?

    I think @bcbishop is Paul, by the way.

    And I don’t think we’re talking about resurrecting Jesus here. I’m thinking Noah’s soul is gonna get transmigrated to raise Anoch. And Sabrina will be the High Priestess, or the true Oracle.

  • #20766
     Blondie 
    Participant

    Firstly, great work @larry. Really enjoyed reading this. So good, so damn good…

    Noah did say he was already dead during Ascension… Meaning, if your theory is correct, this sacrifice has been hanging over his head for a loooong time. How can someone live like that?

  • #20767
     Maranda 
    Participant

    Nice work @larry! The biblical connections hold up better than I thought they would. Two questions – if Noah is to be the sacrifice, then who or what was sacrificed during the new moon? And what was the change it brought? None of us have the answers yet, I believe.

  • #20768
     Megan 
    Participant

    @larry – Are you saying that @bcbishop is going to be creating the new Church of Anoch? A possible return to the old ways of Anoch and that’s why Bryan is being asked to tap into his rage and anger?

  • #20769
     Megan 
    Participant

    That would also mean that @bcbishop is not one of the 12.

  • #20771
     Blondie 
    Participant

    Ok, so I was intrigued enough by this to look at the characters of each of the disciples to see if I could speculate on who might be chosen if this theory comes to anything.

    I enjoyed this summary I found:
    The Apostles

  • #20772
     Jackie 
    Participant

    If this hold any water, may be the disciples are also others: Otis. Sarah. Both are good candidates for betrayal.

    (Biblical names? Btw, keeping with the theme. ‘Otis’ Othniel was the first judge of Israel in the Old Testament. Under his rule, Israel had peace for forty years.and Sarah,was the wife of Abraham and the mother of Isaac in the Old Testament. Her grandsons founded the twelve tribes of Israel and through them Sarah became the “mother of many Nations. )

  • #20773
     Cassandra 
    Participant

    Really interesting, @larry !

  • #20774
     Megan 
    Participant

    And now I have Jesus Christ Superstar stuck in my head.

  • #20775
     Chris 
    Participant

    Certainly a theory that manages to address almost it all… well done @larry.

    My thoughts went in the same directions as @izryn – if the ultimate sacrifice is Noah, what was the sacrifice made in the new moon and maybe more important, what was the new life/change created by it?

    And also, what would really be the role of the 12 chosen ones? Again, what do they need from you? In the Bible, the main work of the disciples is to spread the word of the Lord… So it would be only a matter of followers? Hardly….

    And how does this fit in the bigger picture (again, the whole picture!) and the “chapters”, if thats what really the words on the logo mean… Noah´s sacrifice will happen only in the last chapter? Or it is something that will happen now… And if it is, and something so big ends only this chapter… One can only imagine what will come next.

  • #20776
     Megan 
    Participant

    I’m wondering since we’ve drawn so many parallels to other mythologies (i.e. Egyptian) and occultism as well if we can’t look at ones that Christianity itself drew from when it formed its own mythology. My assumption is that Larry is equating Noah to Jesus Christ here (albeit for much darker purposes) so what are other Christ figures? Osiris? And in other mythologies are there stories in which someone or something is sacrificed before the Christ figure?

  • #20777
     Bryan Bishop 
    Participant

    Awesome theory as always, @larry. My mind is clearer now. At last, all too well, I can see where we all soon will be.

  • #20778
     Melissa 
    Participant

    Wow @larry this is incredible, thank you. If this is all correct then it makes a ton of sense why @mike saw Noah crying at Ascension. Why Noah said “he’s a dead man”.

    When Noah broke into the Registration building with @meghanmayhem and revealed “I pledge my desire for their sacrifice and freedom” I always thought “their” applied to a group of people, not just the one and only Noah. But we’ve been told time and time again that Noah is the face and brand of the SYSTEM. He is the System, the collective whole, the “their“.

    So here’s a question–if Larry is right and we are given the choice–do we stop Noah’s sacrifice?

  • #20779
     Chris 
    Participant

    @coryphella , I think Christ could also be Horus in the Egyptian mythology… Resurrection and all. Wich puts Horace as what? Osiris or Ra (the mythology changes for source to source). And If Noah is Osiris, maybe we have a role for little Timmy later on, to revenge his dad…

    “In his 1949 book The Hero with a Thousand Faces, Joseph Campbell advanced the theory that a single myth stood behind the stories of Krishna, Buddha, Apollonius of Tyana, Jesus, and other hero stories.[90] In his later The Masks of God: Occidental Mythology Campbell stated “(i)t is clear that, whether accurate or not as to biographical detail, the moving legend of the Crucified and Risen Christ was fit to bring a new warmth, immediacy, and humanity, to the old motifs of the beloved Tammuz, Adonis, and Osiris cycles.”

    (someone here talked already about Campbell´s Hero Journey, witch could be a guide line for the script here…)

    Food for thought: “Horus had only four disciples (called ‘Heru-Shemsu’), but at some point in his story there is reference to sixteen followers and a group of unnumbered followers who join Horus in battle (called ‘mesnui’).[…]
    Horus is not reported to have died at all in the vast majority of Egyptian narratives. There is also no crucifixion story. Instead, Horus is usually described as eventually merging with Re (the Sun god) after which he “dies” and is “reborn” every day as the sun rises. There is a parallel account describing Horus’ death and detailing how he was cast in pieces into the water, later fished out by a crocodile at Isis’ request.”
    http://coldcasechristianity.com/2014/is-jesus-simply-a-retelling-of-the-horus-myth/

    Also, for fun:

    “Some authors have argued that certain similarities exist between Dionysus and the traditional Christian portrayal of Jesus.[…]Another parallel can be seen in The Bacchae where Dionysus appears before King Pentheus on charges of claiming divinity, which is compared to the New Testament scene of Jesus being interrogated by Pontius Pilate.[11][18][19] However, a number of scholars dispute this parallel, since the confrontation between Dionysus and Pentheus ends with Pentheus dying, torn into pieces by the mad women, whereas the trial of Jesus ends with him being sentenced to death.” (its a parallel that is mostly dismissed, but with the drinking and all, you know…)

  • #20780
     Megan 
    Participant

    Also I just had a thought – I wonder if Noah will be sacrificed and replaced full time with the AI, like in the Sushi bros email. Maybe it would happen offstage and we will just suddenly see a changed Noah.

  • #20784
     Chris 
    Participant

    But to happen offstage… than the events will be what? meet and greet the new Noah?

  • #20785
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    If we’re talking about who would be one of the 12 apostles…

    My middle name is Philip.

  • #20791
     Megan 
    Participant

    @kwanyin – I don’t know what you mean by “the events.”

  • #20792
     Chris 
    Participant

    @coryphella sorry, i meant the workshop on this saturday and the one on the 13th.

  • #20794
     Megan 
    Participant

    Oh I have no idea, I don’t mean to suggest that the two are related in any way. I don’t think that Noah’s sacrifice, if he is that, is necessarily happening that soon.

    Honestly I know that people yesterday theorized that the treatment received by Brad and Chelsea was for members of the Resistance, or perhaps people who were going to the seminar, but my gut told me that Noah was going to fuck with all of us like that eventually. Which means he’ll be around for a bit.

  • #20795
     Chris 
    Participant

    Yeah, exactly, and like said early here, if the theory of the words/chapters are right, than were does this theory of Noah’s sacrifice fits in the timeline? It does sound like a mighty finale…

  • #20796
     Chelsea 
    Participant

    @larry This is gorgeous, but…

    Ugh. I hate religion for all of this right here. Let’s force a sacrifice from someone not wanting to partake in it! Let’s make someone suffer because we believe it’s going save our souls from the bad place! And it’s ok cause it’ll save them too so we aren’t horrible people look we are helping! Even if they don’t want it! Whoot yea!

    If Noah is being forced into a sacrificial-lamb-stance here, I will do whatever I can to stop it. Because y’all remember that Anoch is a pawn? A tool? “Maybe it’s true, it doesn’t matter.” — Remember her? Noah’s personality… may clash with a lot of other personalities, but let’s not let that bullshit happen again.

    The controversial asshat in me really wants to come out here and be like “Of course there are parallels, but maybe that’s because douche bags tend to fall into a variety pack box of types of douche, and the bible happens to be chock full of douche bag flavors to learn from and draw inspiration.” Oh oops! Did I hit submit? 😉

  • #20797
     Chloe 
    Participant

    This does match up really well, well done @larry.

    With the raising Anoch that you mentioned as well, it also makes me think of Revelation with the whole Antichrist thing that we were on near the beginning of Lust. In Revelation 13:3 the beast (Antichrist) “seemed to have a mortal wound, but its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth marveled as they followed the beast.” Most believe that this means that the Antichrist will be killed or horribly wounded and later “resurrected” or be possessed by Satan leading to the Great Tribulation of the final days. This could parallel with Noah possibly being sacrificed, possessed by Anoch as his vessel, and head us on into the “Great Tribulation” or the final days of The Lust Experience.

    And if we’re thinking some people may be assigned to disciples/roles of people in the Bible, I also wonder if @taysavestheday or maybe even @bcbishop might being playing as John the Apostle, who saw everything that would happen in the final days and wrote the book of Revelation to warn everyone.

  • #20798
     Taylor Winters 
    Participant

    @larry, I find this very interesting–especially that you say “God gives to us according to who HE is, not according to who WE are.” Those who come early, and those who come late receive the same reward.

    However, I don’t believe in this. “Aristotle claims that in order to determine the just distribution of a good, we have to inquire into the telos, or purpose, of the good being distributed.” (Sandel, p. 188, 2010). Sandel makes the claim that if you have a stradivarius violin, you don’t distribute it to everyone–no, you distribute it to the best player. If you have resources, you take care of the strongest first, those who are willing to get the greater purpose from the reward.

    Going against the idea of entropy, Aristotle further proposed that life moves from imperfect to perfect. A seed becomes a plant, a baby becomes an adult. And our path and the trials we come across is what pushes us to become perfect. I see this with Noah and The System; they are pushing us to be better, more perfect. In this way Aristotle believed the essential nature of things lay not at their cause (or beginning) but at their end (telos).

    But is this really Noah’s goal? I don’t think so. This doesn’t sound like Noah. This sounds like Horace to me. Rewarding the strong and punishing the weak. Making people stronger and more perfect through tests and trials. This is exactly how Horace raised Noah, and I see Horace’s influence all over this.

  • #20800
     Andrew Kasch 
    Participant

    Fascinating theories…

    Although I have my doubts that we will see a literal version of Anoch.
    So far, all we have seen are actions motivated by ritual, belief and indoctrination. And if there’s one harsh lesson we learned from the OOA, it was that it was all in service of nothing more than control. None of us have seen or experienced anything that could even remotely be construed as “miraculous” or “supernatural”…only the same tragic consequences that befell Jonestown, Waco, etc.

  • #20803
     Hannah Schenck 
    Participant

    @larry Having been raised with Catholic beliefs shoved down my throat, I cringe reading this, HOWEVER, I could see this being a valid theory. I have a wild theory of who Judas could be, but I’m going to keep that to myself for now until more happens 😉 I definitely agree with you that Noah could very well be the sacrifice, and he knows it. The quote of him saying he’s already dead in the book, has stood out to me for a while as I wondered what he meant by that. And then this beautiful theory landed on the forums and it absolutely makes sense. I’m interested to see, if this theory stands, who the chosen 12 will be…

  • #20808
     Lawrence Meyers 
    Participant

    Don’t take all my blathering too seriously. I’m only looking for parallels that may give narrative or character clues, which can now be altered since they are public. Far be it from me to argue with Aristotle or whether any possible Noah sacrifice is worth stopping or not. That’s your individual decisions.

  • #20817
     Lawrence Meyers 
    Participant

    Judas would theoretically be the person closest to Noah.

    Matthew’s original name was….Levi. He was a tax collector who died a martyr in Ethiopia.

    There’s also one known as…heh…Simon The Zealot. LOL.

    And I was wrong about Saul/Paul, @bcbishop. He is an apostle but not one of the original 12. Morgan might end up being Paul, since he was dedicated to persecuting the early disciples.

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