FB post – 8/9

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This topic contains 21 replies, has 14 voices, and was last updated by  Ciara 2 months, 1 week ago.

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  • #22056
     Kevin 
    Participant

    Painting is Flight of the Swallows by Giacomo Balla.

    fb post 8/9

  • #22058
     Sage 
    Participant

    Maybe be this has already been mentioned, but the blurring or bleed effect on the words is new this chapter right?

  • #22059
     Hannah Schenck 
    Participant

    This sure sounds like it applies to people who are told to think a certain way and are so far under they don’t question it…

    Do you feel like something is lacking in your life? I can fill that void for you and make sure you are always comfortable.

    I know I keep bringing her up but this makes me think about Sarah Thompson and Tanya’s questions about what type of person attracts The System.

    Every time I get a little bit of information I try to reach out to her, every time I go to these seminars Noah and his goons kick me out, she wont talk to me, I’m just trying to get ahold of her.

    The System destroys families. Destroyed her family. She’s gone. I don’t know where she is, if she’s alive, or a willing participant in this. I don’t know anything.

    Sounds like the cage that someone like Sarah is being held in is The System. I still feel like this is not Noah’s doing and it is Horace. Noah is playing along for the time being until he has enough power to do it his way. He has given us clues to point towards this mentality. Horace is the creator of the cage.

  • #22060
     Kevin 
    Participant

    The quote also plays into the idea that those trapped in cages may want to continue living lives of complacency. It’s easier for those inside the cage to stay there and not have to attempt anything, even though flying is completely natural for them and what they’re meant to do.

    Some additional info on the painting:
    A flock of swallows swirl and dive outside the artist’s window. Balla has recreated their speed and movement by placing them in precise sequence, one after another. He appears to have included the rigidity of the shutters to contrast their motionlessness with the birds’ continuous movement.

    Balla painted a series of swallow paintings during his visit to Dusseldorf from 1912 to 1913. The picture is a good example of the work of the Italian Futurists, who were primarily concerned with depicting motion as a symbol for the dynamism of the modern world. Balla publicly declared his affiliation to the Futurist movement in March 1910.

  • #22061
     Cristen 
    Participant

    @shankfx22 definitely fits with a, for lack of a better word, “cult” vibe. System/OSDM or what have you. Whether it’s Horace or Noah I guess just depends on who wrote the rhetoric. I can definitely see Horace pulling strings and Noah just using his charm to deliver the message, willingly or no.

    Maybe @winstonsmith, @kipsie or @meghanmayhem could elaborate here on how this might be a reference to people unknowingly trapped in a cult? And maybe we will know what to look out for on Sunday.

    And oh shit @kevin, that sounds like a page out of the HCDI/Joyce handbook of “just let us give you this experience and accept it” type talk. 😩

    • #22133
       Winston Smith 
      Participant

      @wanda102 I could literally write for months on this, and still not say everything that needed to be said, which means that there’s a lot more that *isn’t* coming up here, and that some of this might be a little stream-of-consciousness, so bear with me.

      OK, so first, nobody thinks they’re in a cult, that’s something that happens to other people. It’s a pejorative word, so when you tell someone they’re in a cult, they don’t hear “I’m very concerned about this group you’re a part of, it seems that they engage in a variety of abusive and manipulative behaviors.” What they hear is “Your religion is stupid, therefore you are stupid because you chose it.” Cults are “evil things”. When you say to someone “You’re in a cult.” what they hear is “You are evil. You do evil things.” They don’t see criticism as being pointed at the group, or the idea, they see it as being pointed directly at themselves as individuals. You are attacking *THEM*, as far as they’re concerned. They don’t act as if they’re defending the group, they act as if they’re defending themselves. An attack on the group *is* an attack on them, as far as they’re concerned.

      If you ask these people if they’re free, they all say “Yes.” In Scientology, it’s called the “Bridge to Total Freedom”. “It’s right there in the name, of course I’m free!” In a certain strict, technical sense, they are. They do have the *ability* to get up and leave at any time. There are just a series of barriers put in front of them to make that extraordinarily difficult. That’s the cage. It doesn’t have bars, this cage is entirely in your mind. It’s not that they’re physically incapable of reading critical material. It’s that they’ve been conditioned to believe that doing so will harm them, and make them “less free”. They are their own gatekeepers.

      Imagine that for a moment. Imagine that someone put you in a prison without walls, guards, or fences. What’s keeping you there? If you escape, that’s fine. We’ll go after you, and try to convince you to come back, but we won’t actually arrest you, and force you to go back. If you want to leave, go for it. But, before you do, let me remind you that if you get more than 200 feet away from your assigned living space, that you’ll get cancer, and die. “Remember Bob? You know how he died of bowel cancer? Well, I didn’t want to tell you this, but Bob got cancer because he wasn’t fully dedicated to our cause.” So, you COULD leave, but you don’t want cancer, do you? Not only that, we’re all gonna go out for ice cream tonight, but you’re not gonna get any, because you’ll have broke the rules. In fact, we’re so concerned about this that we’re going to withhold our affection from you until you come around, and see things the way you should. How much of a mindfuck does it take to make you voluntarily stay in that prison where nothing is actually keeping you there?

      Do you have cats? Is your cat happy? Probably. Does it love you, and enjoy being with you? Probably. Is it free? No, it is not. Does it really matter whether it’s an indoor, or outdoor cat? Sure, it *CAN* leave, and go anywhere it wants, but it usually won’t. Why? Because it has been conditioned to understand that it’s prospects for survival are better if it comes home and lets you feed it every day. It can leave any time it wants, but it doesn’t, because it doesn’t *WANT* to. Why? Don’t cats want to be free? Of course they do. They don’t even understand that they’re not free. If it had wings, would it fly away? They’re not playing this game on the same level we are.

      Let’s say we’re all on an airplane that’s headed for Las Vegas, an appropriately lusty destination. There’s a lot of things we can find there, strippers, gambling, drugs, dancing, whatever it is that floats yer boat. We’re all seeking something different. You’re all sitting on that plane, and you start talking about where you want to go. Each and every one of you can get up, and walk anywhere you want to within the confines of that airplane, cockpit aside. You can walk in the direction of any destination you choose. Want to change your mind, and decide to go to Cleveland? It doesn’t matter how thoroughly convinced you are that your destination is Cleveland, you are going to Las Vegas.

      While you’re on that plane, do you feel like you’re not free? You’re actually quite confined. You can’t even decide when to go to the bathroom, if that little light doesn’t give you permission first. Nothing is actually preventing you from getting up when that light is on, but you know that there will be consequences if you do, so you don’t, because those consequences can potentially be even larger than the consequences of pissing your pants. Fear is what keeps you in your seat, not a sense of courtesy. Fear of what? Flight attendants? No, fear of “consequences.”

      Cults are kind of like that. Everyone is talking about all the great places they’re gonna go, and the wonderful things they’re gonna do when they get there, because they just got finished talking to the travel agent, who sold them a *WONDERFUL* package. They just don’t realize that’s not where they’re going. The travel agent lied to them. They’re not actually going on vacation, they’re being sold into human slavery. Oops.

      Here’s another example. You’re in the middle of the ocean, shark diving, because that sounds fucking rad. You’re in a cage, right? Do you see that cage as a prison, or do you see that cage as the thing that’s protecting you from a very dangerous world just beyond its borders?

      When you’re in a cult, you’re told that inside the cage, you’re going to be safe from that dangerous world outside. You believe it, because you’ve been shown a lot of scary, ugly things about the world, because it *is* a scary, ugly place. What you don’t understand at the time, is that there are monsters inside the cage with you too. In fact, they built the cage, and what you’re actually in is a farm. Maybe you’re being farmed for money, or maybe it’s free labor, but you are a product being farmed. A farmer might give his cows a beautiful pasture to enjoy, they might even want to treat their cows more “ethically” than the neighbor. Free range, and all that jazz. Some cows even get massaged with sake and beer. That sounds fucking great! In a sense, he wants his cows to be happy, but not because he actually cares about their happiness. It’s just that unhappy cows don’t taste as good, and unhealthy cows negatively affect his profitability. What’s more important to him, his family’s happiness, or the cows? Every moment of that cow’s life is built around the *illusion* of a “natural environment”. You’re free to roam anywhere you like, as long as you don’t leave that cage.

      When you’re leading a cow to the slaughterhouse, you don’t want it to know where it’s going. You want that cow to be oblivious to what’s going on, by distracting it with pleasant things. If it knows where it’s going, it gets scared, and the meat tastes bad. Does the farmer not scare the cows because it’s mean? Nah, he does it because it makes the meat taste better.

      To a cult, you are a cow. You’re not a person, you’re a resource being farmed.

      Dogs are man’s best friend, we can all agree that dogs are awesome. They’re a part of our lives in a way that NO other animal is. They know what we’re thinking, they understand our gaze, they know what pointing means, they know how to communicate with us. They CRAVE our attention, and affection. If they don’t get it, they suffer. Why? Because we’ve spent the last 20-30,000 years turning them into slaves that don’t even *know* they’re slaves. They think we’re fucking great. They love us. We love them too, but we also own them, and we never, ever forget that. That dog’s entire life is a cage of sorts. That doesn’t mean the dog is unhappy. It really does love you. But, is it free? That dog can’t even decide when it’s time to go to the bathroom without your permission. In fact, it’s been trained to wait for your permission. You might even say it’s waiting for that little bell to ding, and the seatbelt light to turn off.

      None of this is meant as a commentary on pets, or farming, sharks, or airplanes. It’s an illustration of the nature of the power relationship between a cult member, and the cult they’re a part of.

      Why do you clip a bird’s wings? So it can’t fly away. Why does it live in a cage? So it doesn’t shit on your floor.

  • #22062
     Hannah Schenck 
    Participant

    @kevin

    The quote also plays into the idea that those trapped in cages may want to continue living lives of complacency. It’s easier for those inside the cage to stay there and not have to attempt anything, even though flying is completely natural for them and what they’re meant to do.

    I agree entirely. I could also argue the other side of it, that if the cage is all they know (given the fact they are brainwashed and/or made to forget what life was like beforehand) that there is no urge or curiosity to break free and explore what is on the other side of the metal bars.

    @wanda102

    And oh shit @kevin, that sounds like a page out of the HCDI/Joyce handbook of “just let us give you this experience and accept it” type talk. 😩

    This would make sense, especially since she is tied to the OSDM and most likely working with Horace

  • #22064
     Buz Wallick 
    Moderator

    @shankfx22 you still haven’t gotten confirmation that Sarah Thompson is NOT Sarah Sinclair right?

    I find it…. suspect there are multiple Sarah’s. Maybe I’m missing something.

  • #22066
     Hannah Schenck 
    Participant

    @thebuz I have NOT gotten that confirmation yet. I sent her a screen shot of the Sinclair family from their last video to see if Sarah Sinclair is Sarah Thompson. Initially I thought it was Sabrina or Macy due to the description @tanyathompson gave me of her sister, and the fact that Sarah and Sarah seemed like too easy of a connection, but after hearing all of this about these people being changed by name and looks, Sarah Sinclair could very well be Sarah Thompson. I’m waiting for Tanya to respond to me, she has not been active since we last spoke.

  • #22068
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    Yep, when one is raised in a certain environment, it’s easy for them to come to accept that environment as “normal”. It may take being exposed and immersed in other cultures, other ways of thinking to bring them to accept there are other ways of living. It’s that idea of culture shock.

    In regards to this, you have already pointed out the possible connections to the actors / brainwashed people. But what if this also relates to us? We’ve always seen this as just a theater thing. To consider this may actually be happening this time around can seem “wrong” to people because we’ve been sitting in the damn cage this whole time.

  • #22069
     Twan Intarathuch 
    Participant

    I’m admittedly in a dark place in my life but here it goes…

    Cages take away freedom, they make us all prisoners, but cages also keep the inside monsters locked in and the outside monsters locked out.

  • #22070
     Hannah Schenck 
    Participant

    @genghistwan That is a really solid and gut wrenching truth. I like that this opens another door to the theory of who would be willing to stay in the cage

    Also, I wonder at what stage in The System do the alters come into play? I would imagine it is strategic to introduce them once the “followers” are already somewhat brainwashed/submerged into the mentality desired. Would the event this weekend be too soon to show us what is really going on?

  • #22071
     Andrew Kasch 
    Participant

    God, I love Jodorowsky.

    “You are engaging in madness. I feel obliged to accompany you.”

  • #22072
     Lauren Bello 
    Moderator

    In regards to this, you have already pointed out the possible connections to the actors / brainwashed people. But what if this also relates to us? We’ve always seen this as just a theater thing. To consider this may actually be happening this time around can seem “wrong” to people because we’ve been sitting in the damn cage this whole time.

    That’s such a good point. Sarah was basically urged to “fly” this week, and she refused. To Elizabeth/Cynthia, perhaps that looks like Sarah choosing to stay caged.

  • #22073
     Brad Ruwe 
    Participant

    It’s very possible. I know we were both very surprised when she called back in shock that she was still at the apartment. Though Sarah not leaving may have been less “this is just theater” and more “I’m utterly exhausted”. It had been a long few days for us and we were both exhausted. Though I know we were too wired to sleep for another hour or so after our visitor.

  • #22074
     Anonymous

    I am not going to flee my apartment.

  • #22075
     Anonymous

    Without knowing me or my motivations, of course I will be judged for choosing to stay inside a cage. If that is how they choose to see me, so be it.

  • #22159
     Lawrence Meyers 
    Participant

    @winstonsmith It isn’t even restricted to cults. It’s any form of ideology. I don’t happen to buy into Christ as the Son of God, but I know those who do, some of them are theological scholars of the highest intellect. They are totally rational, and have cogent and rather convincing arguments.

    But I think this is also a callback to Plato’s Cave.

    One cannot complete one’s journey to consciousness if one does not even know what one does not know.

  • #22169
     Winston Smith 
    Participant

    @larry Yeah, cults are not about religion. They’re about power, and control. Religion is just one of many effective mechanisms. It’s the greatest scam that’s ever existed. I convince you that you have to follow the rules in my special book, or else…you will suffer the consequence of eternal damnation. Your entire spiritual existence in this life, and any other is dependent on you following the rules laid out in MY special book. If you don’t follow the rules, you’re not just fucked in this life, you’re fucked FOR ETERNITY. You can do a LOT with that kind of power. Eternal suffering is one hell of a “consequence”, isn’t it?

    Reading that paragraph will make many people feel deeply uncomfortable, not because they disagree with any of it, but because they’re not sure if I’m talking about *their* special book, or someone else’s. If I’m talking about someone else’s special book, that’s ok. If I’m talking about theirs, that’s a whole different story.

    The best part is that you can promise eternal salvation in exchange for compliance, but you don’t actually have to deliver *anything*. I get your compliance, because you believe that your reward will be eternal salvation. What are you gonna do, come back from the dead, and sue me for not delivering the agreed upon afterlife? Tell everyone I’m a liar? You can’t, you’re too busy being dead. There is literally nobody alive who can refute my solemn, and totally true promise that you will receive life everlasting, if only you follow my rules.

    Is it a coincidence that the Word of God always comes from the mouth of a man? Who’s words are they really?

    The scariest thing I ever learned about cults, is that these behaviors aren’t about cults, or religion. They’re not about belief, or non-belief. They’re about power, and control, and they can be exercised in a dizzying variety of contexts, in every aspect of each and every one of our lives. Why are we brand loyal? Is Tide significantly different from Downy? Do you even know what the difference is? Could you articulate that in a way that didn’t just regurgitate what you heard in a commercial? Do you have a real, qualitative opinion about the merits of Tide vs. Downy? If not, who’s opinion do you have? Who’s opinion are you basing your purchases on? Do you think you’d be terribly disappointed if you switched? Probably not, but you don’t…because you fear the consequences of the thing you don’t know. It’s easier to stick with the thing that you do.

    You see it in politics, you see it in advertising, you see it in food, you see it in entertainment, you see it in religion, you see it in business, you see in personal relationships, you see it in friends, you see it in adversaries, you see it *EVERYWHERE*.

    We demonize each other for our political views every day. You want this world to be a better place. Whether you’re liberal, conservative, or unicorn, it doesn’t matter. You probably want the world to become a better place. What do the people on the “other side” want? Don’t they see that you’re just trying to make the world a better place? How could they be opposed to that? What the fuck is wrong with them? Why are they trying to stop you from making the world better? Most of the time, we don’t even remember WHY we believe what we do. We just know that it’s important to protect those beliefs against the heretics, and heathens.

    It doesn’t matter who you are, or what you believe. To someone, you’re nothing but a cow.

  • #22183
     Anonymous

    Having spent a majority of my life being under someone’s power and control in some way, shape, or form and having been personally endangered by said elements, those experiences are what led me not to leave a couple of nights ago. Here is a stranger whom I have never met before, who has obviously engaged in some shenanigans and things of a questionable nature, and she is telling me I should leave the apartment. I’m tired. I’m exhausted. I’ve been working myself to the fucking bone for the past six months and I am now being told to leave because of some danger that may befall my person. Fuck that. I know she meant well and I hope to God that she is okay.

    However, the reality is I am not currently in danger with the Powers That Be/The System/whatever the fuck else they call themselves. Yes, I am so full of hubris right now. But why do I make such claims? Because danger to me is very real. It is what keeps me up at night. It is what makes me come up with all of the different scenarios in my head whenever something goes awry and I either have to fix it or get the hell out of dodge. I literally had to worry for my life in a completely different scenario a week after the iConfidant event because an unhinged person from a different life came out of the blue. That is real danger. That is real fear.

    Has The System facilitated such a reaction from me? No. Has the BOS facilitated such a reaction from me? No. I do not feel like I am in any danger so why would I leave my apartment? More specifically why would I leave my apartment when I have no place to go? Sure, I could go to any of your homes, but why would you house someone who is in “danger”? These are the things that I’ve thought about since whatever happened a couple nights ago happened. It’s full of rambling and hubris and fatigue…

  • #22196
     Robert Fuller 
    Participant

    @mamatato Well, you clearly weren’t killed or harmed in any way by not leaving your apartment, so I think you made the right call.

  • #22281
     Ciara 
    Participant

    To me this reads more like… the visionaries and revolutionaries and those who have new ideas will always be judged and dismissed by those who have no exposure to them, or who have never had the chance to see the things they have. But there also may be some significance to the fact that it’s not that a bird in a cage WON’T fly… it can’t. Maybe not everyone can “fly” as it were.

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